Uses for the Hunter

[MrKittens]

Hey all,

I recently bought the Hoffman box set, and am going to start playing it soon. I've read several threads that suggest the Peacekeeper and Ryle as highly recommended additions, and I'll make up my mind between the Attendant and the Toolkit at some point. However, I've never seen anyone post a list with a Hunter; I've actually seen several people say negative things about it.

Since I *do* have it, and it is 1/3 of my current constructs, what do I do with it? Just use it for now, 'till I can replace it with something better? Replace it with some Ortegas (I got the Perdita box set, too) as a waste of stones? What advice do you have for someone with a Hunter?

[Rathnard]

Okay, so keeping in mind that I've never used Hoffman before, but know the game back to front...

To me, the Hunter is a model that can be used and remain effective while independent of the Hoff-ball (ie. that mass of constructs you tend to place Hoffman in the centre of). It's fast and has a decent damage output, but it's not amazing. So you need to use it to engage isolated targets or take lightly defended objectives (multiple objective games like Line in the Sand are the kind of Strategies Hoffman has trouble with).

Other than that, you could also see him as a cheap source of three scrap counters. So you do what you can with the Hunter, watch it die, and then use the scrap for actions like Detonate Scrap or Combat Mechanic.

The Hunter could also tow Hoffman along, but better choices tend to be the Peacekeeper, Warden or even a Mechanical Rider.

The most direct alternative to the Hunter is the Large Steampunk Arachnid, who from memory tends to be better for the same cost. It's a Special Forces: M&SU asset though, so you can't use him with Ryle or Lucius (who are Special Forces: Elite Division models).

[Turbodog]

Welcome!

All respects to Rathnard (who has fantastic experience with the game and figuring out models).

I do own and play Hoffman and have used the hunter quite a bit. I'll offer the following opinions/feedback on Rath's advice.

In my experience, the hunter is not a "fast" model. It does walk at 5", but it's large base size means it often has to deal with terrain or "going around" other models. Since it doesn't have anything to ignore terrain movement penalties (like the peacekeeper or warders do) and it doesn't have pass through to ignore models, and it doesn't have nimble or other ways to easily generate AP, it feels slow to me. Espcecially when Hoffman is "attached" to a peacekeeper with arachnid.

What does make the hunter significantly faster than many model is the Shadow ability. The free movement with shadow can allow the hunter to engage quickly. But...

Away from guardian/hoffman the hunter is really quite fragile. It's wounds, armor, and defense resemble more a 4 pt. guild guard or death marshall than a 6 pt. model. So while it can walk off on it's own to take an objective, I wouldn't trust it more than I would trust a solo guild guard doing the same.

That's why shadow is tricky. You don't want to overstretch yourself and just send it to it's doom. I've had more success using shadow as a deterrant than as actual movement.

The chain spear of the hunter offers some nice possibilities - but really needs Hoffman to machine puppet it to be a reliable weapon. Cb 4 is just not that terrific. So, again, the Hunter becomes something that benefits greatly from staying nearer to Hoffman, rather than running off on it's own.

Finally, one of the most successful uses I've had with the hunter is for it to be Hoffman's alternate carrier once the peacekeeper goes down. Again, for this reason, it's good to stay at least somewhat close to Hoffman.

So in play, I keep my hunter detached (not in base to base contact) from the "hoff-ball" of the guardian and peacekeeper - but within one walk action of them. He's used like I would use a death marshall, guild guard, or witchling - as counterattack or bait or extra activations as the need arises. But he does offer some unique utility and options for the crew as well (a timely arrest is a nice spell if you can pull it off).

I'll go ahead and note that when used like this, the Hunter is fulfilling a role that the new Warden can also easily fulfill, and with greater effect since it is more mobile. When taking into account the Warden is also cheaper by 1 ss - many people bypass hiring a hunter.

Good luck with the Hoffman!

[DocMoen]

I find that the best use for the Hunter is to remain in my bag away from all the scary fighting. It startles easily.

[dgraz]

but know the game back to front...

Isn't it tough to play the game backwards like that? You should at least try front to back....you'll probably enjoy the game much more.

[MrKittens]

So all in all, it seems like the Hunter is a defective model? Was I better off buying just Hoffman and skipping it, the Watcher and the Guardian, since everyone seems to want to run Peacekeepers, Ryle, Riders (of one variety or another) and Wardens with him? Was the boxset really that bad? Man, I feel foolish for not doing my research first.

[Gruesome]

So all in all, it seems like the Hunter is a defective model? Was I better off buying just Hoffman and skipping it, the Watcher and the Guardian, since everyone seems to want to run Peacekeepers, Ryle, Riders (of one variety or another) and Wardens with him? Was the boxset really that bad? Man, I feel foolish for not doing my research first.

Let me start by saying, I do not know much about the Hunter. What I *DO* know is that I bought the same boxset for my son as a gift for the summer and its sitting hidden in my office for another week before I give it to him so I hope that Hunter is not useless.

What I find here is that most models that are not optimal for their points get trashed. Not being optimal for the points is not even in the ballpark of being defective. I would not let such views make me feel bad about purchases.
I think that this thread could become useful if the tone of it changed from:
"Is the Hunter worth his points and where are the points better spent?"
to:
"What can we do to make the Hunter work as best as it can and what jobs/stategies/schemes would it be best at?"

There HAVE been some nice posts here, so this thread is not nearly as bad as others that are floating around, though.

I know that in a couple weeks after my son has the boxset and we've assembled and primed it, I might have something to say about its uses. (Assembled and primed is our criteria for playing... Actually painting our models is something we apparently like to do one week before Adepticon in an insane paint-fest week where we rush everything because there is too much to do)

[elusive87]

So all in all, it seems like the Hunter is a defective model? Was I better off buying just Hoffman and skipping it, the Watcher and the Guardian, since everyone seems to want to run Peacekeepers, Ryle, Riders (of one variety or another) and Wardens with him? Was the boxset really that bad? Man, I feel foolish for not doing my research first.

I wouldn't feel foolish. Although I find the Hunter to be the model in the box that I use the least, I still use everything in that box from time to time and still manage to do fairly well. The Guardian and Watcher generally see more use, but the hunter still has a place.

[sinistercats]

At the Nova Open last year Zee schooled lots of folks on using Hunter and Coppelius together. There's a lot of synergy there to be exploited...

[MrKittens]

The Guardian and Watcher generally see more use, but the hunter still has a place.

There's a lot of synergy there to be exploited...

OK, so, the Hunter "still has a place", and there's "synergy to be exploited." What's the place, and what synergy are you talking about? I still haven't had a chance to run the list, but the problems I've heard here (it's a run-solo unit in a brick army type) do seem quite crippling. What do I do?