House rule: Nekima revised

[ThePandaDirector]

Edit: Oh nilus... go eat poo =P

henchmen only lead special forces, therefore you couldn't get away with simply making her the only member of the group; you'd have to add the characteristic to other nephilim, which may be a burden to some masters.

Hi, I don't even really play Malifaux at the moment (have all the books though), but Henchmen aren't limited to Special forces, Special Forces are limited to Henchmen. Collodi can hire Special Forces: Doll, but can also hire Stitched Togethers because they're Dolls (but not Special Forces: Dolls and so not restricted to others). Molly can hire Belles without Belles getting tagged Special Forces: Horrors, etc. So with Nekima, if she were to be a Henchwoman, she could hire any Nephilim she wants without them getting tied to her, but new Nephilim could be created as Special Forces: Ancient Nephilim. As for balance, I imagine other SF would see more love considering the amount of Nephilim.

I don't really have an opinion on anything else, as I can understand the OP's reasoning, but don't like Neverborn enough to look more closely. I just wanted to point out that Nephilim wouldn't have to be burdened with SF if Nekima were to become a Henchwoman.

Have a nice day y'all.

[Sybaris]

Why are you so intent on making her another melee monster in a faction that's already full of melee monsters?

Because that's how i see her since i read the fluff. Granted we have little meat to chew on, but the current rules maker her work in an opposite direction during a game. In my vision, she has evolved to be the epitome of the Nephilim subgroup.

[ThePandaDirector]

Hypothetically, in a fluff powered sense (which Wyrd is prone to follow or ignore), Lilith and Nekima crews would be as follows:

Lilith: Mother of monsters, supports her crew and allows them to become stronger, has spells and synergy with the trickier Nephilim. She's still beatstick (from what I hear), but she's a Master afterall, and has more options.

Nekima: Lady Justice just grew horns (or Viktoria, but that's not as witty), and a crew would consist of little synergy beyond "hit stick over head" with Nekima fighting for the limelight and her less well supported crew acting as her support, rather than the other way round.

I can see it on a very theoretical sense, and part of me wants to see Nephilim crews fighting each other (that isn't Lilith versus Lilith), but it is pure theory and the kind of large change I don't see happening beyond the creation of a new Nekima (along with Samael and Misaki) or a new game mechanic (along with fluff advancement).

I'm beginning to remember why I stick to Puppet Wars playtesting, don't envy those chaps over in Malifaux ;)

[ooshawn]

I say give her a henchmen reserve of the cost of a tot or young nephalim and use soulstone and its a rap. Best henchmen in the game for my tastes

[Sybaris]

The way I see it, there are two problems with Nekima atm.

a) she is too expensive for what she does

b) she performs as a support model

Alot of people would be satisfied with a solution to a), but for me it's more than that; the way the model is meant to act on the table is too far from what the story depicts. I certainly can deal with changes from fluff to gameplay, and i always seek for a balanced game too (i don't want Nekima to be more powerful than Lady J for example), but Malifaux isn't D&D miniatures, so the story matters to me, and when i look at Nekima's role on the table, i just thought i could give it a twist ;)

[Q'iq'el]

I suggest not jumping into Henchmen grounds just yet. If you want it, sure, second step, but lets make her a minion that works first.

Besides some purely aesthetic problems with some of the names of the new abilities (how about Gorging on Blood rather than Gorging Bloodlust?), I suggest giving her some bonuses to hit with that sword of her.

She should be, at the very least, slightly better than a Mature Nephilim in combat (if we go for a combat master). So not only the slightly higher Cb, but also equivalent of Paired Claws would be recommended (enough to give her sword to hit).

I also suggest removing instinctual (it makes sense the player has to choose which of the 3 (0) actions he wants to use) and melee expert and give her a full fledged Fast.

[Sybaris]

I suggest not jumping into Henchmen grounds just yet. If you want it, sure, second step, but lets make her a minion that works first.

Besides some purely aesthetic problems with some of the names of the new abilities (how about Gorging on Blood rather than Gorging Bloodlust?), I suggest giving her some bonuses to hit with that sword of her.

She should be, at the very least, slightly better than a Mature Nephilim in combat (if we go for a combat master). So not only the slightly higher Cb, but also equivalent of Paired Claws would be recommended (enough to give her sword to hit).

I also suggest removing instinctual (it makes sense the player has to choose which of the 3 (0) actions he wants to use) and melee expert and give her a full fledged Fast.

I agree that the first step is to fix her fighting prowess, and then add in the henchwoman rule to allow for her crew. That said, i always have a problem when choosing a master with Nekima and her Nephilim. Lilith is pretty much out of the question, while the Dreamer has nothing to do with her, and Pandora probably isn't sane enough to care. The only one left is Zoraida, and she seems to be far more in league with Lilith (mentionning that Nekima is not easy to control).

The reason i kept instinctual and melee expert is to keep her slower than Lilith, and allow her to use 2 of her 0 actions in the middle of a tough situation (with instinctual, you can use blood greed and gorging on blood for 1 healing flip per turn, even though it would be quite costly on your crew). It's an indirect way to make her tougher and more "physical" than her sister.

Anyway, back to making her "Fighter First".

You mention a higher Cb, which would put her at 8. Currently, only aViktoria get as far as i know. They do mention that Nekima is a better fighter than Lilith in the text (try that on the table with current rules :P! )...so it does give a hint.

About the to hit, i'd really like to playtest that with the new triggers, just to make sure it wouldn't be too strong (like, avatar strong).

[Sybaris]

I was toying around with a few variants (and the current rules card) and wondered if it could be as simple as giving her the Onslaught trigger (rather than throw aside)

Thanks to her sword, it's easier to trigger than for many models.

[Fetid Strumpet]

Auto Triggering Onslaught? I'm not certain about that. Not on a model with a great Cb score and a min dmg of 3 anyway.

[Ozz]

Not an auto trigger, it requires a Ram and a Mask, and the Great sword only grants 1 suit, so it is just a very likely trigger rather than auto. But i do think with the positive damage flip and such a decent damage profile it may be a bit extreme having a 50% chance for the trigger, but this shall not be me using it so i shall await your tests