Lilith Non-Growth list

[Mournafein]

So I've been trying to perfect a non-growth list, for Lilith. Problem is that Lilith synergises most with Nephilim (Obviously), and my group usually plays little scraps. Around 25ss, usually. So for 25, the best I can come up with so far is:

Lilith (Maybe avatar, if I can't find anything better to do with the SS)
Tuco
Lelu
Lilitu
6ss cache.

The idea is to use Tuco and the twins to lure and team up on lower-wp models, using Lilith to cover them and transposition stray models. Cheating damage high, where necessary.

Thoughts, criticism, and suggestions?

[omnivision6]

Waldgeists have great synergy with Lilith. She can creat a forest where and when they need it.

[Mournafein]

6 points, though. While they're good, and Lilith does synergise well with them, they lack the strategic synergy that I would need. I'll need Lilith to be able to plop a forest down on a whim. If the Waldegeist is in a jam, it'd condemn it to take the forest. Also: They would have no wound-recovery ability (Aside from Lilitu's 2 wd heal, if by some strange reason it is within 2" of her). LookIng more towards things that are capable of synergising, with ability to operate independently. I was thinking of bringing a BBS, just to pass Fast around to Tuco.

[notmikehill]

It really depends on your strategies here. This list seems to play pretty well to a destroy the evidence kind of deal. The only problem I can see is if somebody kills one of your twins your list will slowly fizzle as the games goes on.

For a claim jump kind of strategy I'd say:

Lilith
Waldgheist x2
Terror tot x2
Young Nephilim

cache 5

with that list you have a good amount of board control with 2 figures for durability, 2 figures as objective grabbers/transposition targets and the young to clean up in fights. Also, if you can keep the tots alive as the fight goes on you can grow the tots into new youngs.

[Rathnard]

I think people overestimate Lilith's synergy with Nephilim. For her it basically boils down to being able to get blood counters, and having a (0) action that companions Nephilim. The former is only useful if you plan to use a grow list and the latter realistically only needs one Nephilim in the list anyway.

Personally, I'd actualy like to try something like this;

Lilith
3x Silurid 15
Tuco 7 (7SS Pool)

The Silurid should synergise well with Lilth and her Rush of Magic (Leap needs 7's to cast), and Tuco adds a mobile shooting platform to balance out the melee focus of the crew. At 30SS I'd probably add a Terror tot and Primordial Magic, both to up the model count and give me some Transposition options.

[ooshawn]

I look at tuco like every other day in book 3 when i'm bored and he has never impressed me. I dont see why he would be better than two tots

[Mournafein]

Rathnard: I've never used Silurids, so I really can't say if the list is good or not... But I know that Tuco will almost always go with me. Having a mobile shooter is very nice, combined with Lilith. I take him often, and he doesn't disappoint (Even if he's targeted for an objective). If I transposition someone, he can shoot at them, if I don't kill them. Two tots are melee. Removing someone's faction affiliation for an entire encounter is insanely good, if you can hit a unique or master. Against people that like to bunch, the blast is amazing (Som'er Jones and ophelia). Flay in melee. Deploy anywhere but objectives and enemies. Terrifying 13, with a 0 action. An effective wp of 7. And let's not forget nimble.

NotMike: I would take that list, if not for the Tots and Young. I love Lilith, but I'm trying not to revolve around things that grow, as I am trying to avoid that. Tots aren't durable enough for going against Arcanist or Som'er. Thank you though! If you can come up with something without tots, that's be great!

[Q'iq'el]

6 points, though. While they're good, and Lilith does synergise well with them, they lack the strategic synergy that I would need. I'll need Lilith to be able to plop a forest down on a whim. If the Waldegeist is in a jam, it'd condemn it to take the forest.

There's plenty of strategic synergy. You use Waldgeist and the forest it controls to deny opponent the table and hoard his minions where Lilith wants to fight them. If you play on the table with larger woods (GW plasitc wood for example), it is one of the best utility models for her and a great frustration for the opponent.

If you rely only on Illusionary Forest, it perhaps isn't the best to bring the Waldgeist... However you'll have plenty of small forests if you manifest the Avatar, right? They may not be big enough to matter on some tables, but they can do nasty things on city and village tables where you can block entire passages with a well placed 3" forest, esp. if it has a Waldgeist in it.

[Murphy'sLawyer]

Hey there Mournafein, hope I am not too late responding.

My main concern with your list is all the models cost 7ss which is expensive. Your major problem being the Lelu. You won't have enough models to distract your opponent from targeting your force and alpha striking would be not an issue.

Lilith is fast and the twins are pretty stationary support models that love to stick close to each other. So separating them would be bad. If one dies so does the other soon after. So Transpositioning Lelu, your only good target, would be bad becuase then Lelu would be open to be killedand an enemy model would be close to your Lilitu.

So Lilith's signature spell wouldn't get much use.

I say keep Tuco and consider a waldgeist for a defensive model that loves Lilith's forest and a young Nephilim for an offensive model.

Throw in either a Cherub for love or a Primordial Magic for the extra card and you will have an 8 ss pool. And only one model to grow if you wish. (No one is going to think your cheesy for growing a Young to a Mature the old fasion way. )

Also a trick you can use is when an opponent sends in a model to get Tuco in melee just transposition that model with the Young Nephilim and now that model has to deal with Lilith and the Waldgeist. Niether of which are easy to kill in melee. And your Young Nephilim is with Tuco ready for some nasty offensive attacks.

[the junkie]

In a 30ss game vs Kirai I ran the following.
Lilith
P. Magic
Tuco
Lelu x2
Lilitu

It was light on SS cache but was very effective and killing things. I was dealing with Kirai's spirits who wouldn't help me grow so I tried the list above and boy was it cool. I lost the game 3-6 (shared line in the sand) but even though i was out activated out the wazu I felt I had some really strong activations to deal with the key model or two a turn.