Malifaux Masters: A Tier List

[Math Mathonwy]

I'm referring to his post above in this thread, where he quite categorically claims Nicodem won't live past turn two bar for luck (or forfeit the game by killing own models just to prolong the agony).

I took that to mean that when a good Dreamer player plays a good Nicodem player. A lousy Dreamer player probably won't do the conservative "I only have LCB, basically, for the first two rounds"-approach.

[Calmdown]

I'm referring to his post above in this thread, where he quite categorically claims Nicodem won't live past turn two bar for luck (or forfeit the game by killing own models just to prolong the agony).

I'm absolutely saying that that. I've always said that I don't think I'm the best Malifaux player, but I very much doubt you could find anyone in the world who could beat me with any kind of regularity with Nicodem whilst I'm playing Dreamer with his current rules.

Oh, and if you're talking about Nicodem having threat range from Dead Rider, then one of the following is going to happen; either I'm going to kill Dead Rider in activation 1, or I'm going to drop my whole list - not just Chompy - on your totally unsupported Nicodem, and you're going to have to deal with a pile of Lelus in your face while the rest of your list trudges up the board.

And to tie this back to the Op again; this is not because I am super skilled, this is just because I know how to play Dreamer. Because I know how to play Dreamer, there skill of the Nicodem player becomes irrelevent because he is just too far below Dreamer in power level.

[Mergoth]

This is a crazy proposition. It would mean that Wyrd had achieved perfect balance on Masters and minions so a Seamus with nothing but Guild Autopsies should have an equal chance against a Dreamer list with the Twins.

Uhh, no. That is an example of poor list building with a complete lack of synergy, vs a well built list. List building comes under the heading of "player skill and experience".

[CunningStunt]

Uhh, no. That is an example of poor list building with a complete lack of synergy, vs a well built list. List building comes under the heading of "player skill and experience".

I agree with this.

Still it doesn't get around the fact that belief that Wyrd managed to create 20(+6 Henchment) perfectly balanced masters is quite a stretch. You might not believe the power gap is as big as some of use do but surely you must see there are variations?

[Q'iq'el]

Oh, and if you're talking about Nicodem having threat range from Dead Rider...

For the clarity's sake, that was another poster.

[Spiku]

Q'iq'el: He was mentioning it to cover any bases re: Nico's max base threatrange being 16".

[Math Mathonwy]

Uhh, no. That is an example of poor list building with a complete lack of synergy, vs a well built list. List building comes under the heading of "player skill and experience".

If Wyrd was able to build over two dozen perfectly balanced Masters and Henchmen, why didn't they use these super powers to create perfectly balanced Minions as well?

[Mergoth]

I agree with this.

Still it doesn't get around the fact that belief that Wyrd managed to create 20(+6 Henchment) perfectly balanced masters is quite a stretch. You might not believe the power gap is as big as some of use do but surely you must see there are variations?

Of course there are variations. But depending on the situation this variation may or may not come into play as either a positive or negative.

If Wyrd was able to build over two dozen perfectly balanced Masters and Henchmen, why didn't they use these super powers to create perfectly balanced Minions as well?

I think "synergy" covers that. For example, Autopsies are seldom a good idea to hire, but can be useful to summon in depending on the situation at hand. They just add to the options ingame, and a skilled player can identify the correct time and capitalise on it.
Seamus will get more bang for his buck from any Belle, Nicodem will get more from Killjoy, Zoraida more from Papa Loco etc. Part of the fun is working out the function for a particular minion in a crew, or indeed if it fits well in the crew at all, and this is down to skill and experience.

People seem to believe anything that is on the internet, and quote it as gospel without trying anything new for themselves. Makes me a sad panda.

[Spiku]

Your last sentence is a strange one to use in this scenario, given that most of the players here have played half of the rest in tournaments =3

Edit: Except in regard to gremlins, where most people just regurgitate what they were told

[Math Mathonwy]

I think "synergy" covers that. For example, Autopsies are seldom a good idea to hire, but can be useful to summon in depending on the situation at hand. They just add to the options ingame, and a skilled player can identify the correct time and capitalise on it.
Seamus will get more bang for his buck from any Belle, Nicodem will get more from Killjoy, Zoraida more from Papa Loco etc. Part of the fun is working out the function for a particular minion in a crew, or indeed if it fits well in the crew at all, and this is down to skill and experience.

Synergy or not, there are clear discrepancies between the abilities of different minions. An Ice Golem is a bad minion that you should never take. There are always better options. Always.

I can't believe that you actually believe that the game is perfectly balanced. Did you think this before the changes to, for example, the Alps or the Gravedigger mechanic? Actually, judging by your join date, you weren't around when the Gravedigger mechanic was changed, right?

Claiming that Seamus (or Molly!) is just as good as Dreamer is... I dunno, have you been to many tournaments, out of interest? Do you play only with a couple of people or do you play a wide variety of opponents?

People seem to believe anything that is on the internet, and quote it as gospel without trying anything new for themselves. Makes me a sad panda.

You are implying that I haven't played enough and am just aping what I've read on the forums?