Assimilate and the Guardian's Protect spell.

[Jonas Albrecht]

If C. Hoffman Assimilates (1)Protect, and casts it on his Mobile Toolkit, would the effects end once the Guardian casts the spell?

(1)Protect (CC:14/Rst - /Rg: 3)
When target model suffers Wds while within 3" of this model, this model may suffer those Wds instead. This spell ends when this model or the target is removed from play or this spell is cast on another target.

[karn987]

I don't believe so as it says "this" model which refers to the model using the spell.

So be it Hoffman or a Doppelganger using Mimic, "this" refers to the model making the action.

[LoboStele]

Yeah, I'd agree with Karn. For one, you can't Assimilate anything that specifies a model's exact name, and I think they included that wording in Assimilate specifically to help understand situations like these. So, in this case, if Hoffman Assimilates Protect, then the use of "this model" would refer to Hoffman now, and not the Guardian.

Basically, think of Assimilate as copying the entire ability, word for word, over onto Hoffman's card. Then it doesn't matter if the Guardian even exists anymore.

[Jonas Albrecht]

Excellent. So if Hoffman were to Protect some Wds off his MT, could those Wds be Protected off him by the Guardian?

[karn987]

Excellent. So if Hoffman were to Protect some Wds off his MT, could those Wds be Protected off him by the Guardian?


Umm... it appears so actually. You create a train for these Wds to Travel down XD

[Jonas Albrecht]

Poor Guardian.

[infernosolarc]

That is a good trick. With Damage Prevention from Soulstones or Healing Flips or just Assimilating Self-Repair, Hoffman can take a fair bit of punishment if you need him to.

[tadaka]

The protect chain works very well and makes a crew ungodly hard to kill off. I am enjoying the hell out of it. Other players I fight not so much :)

[Tuesday]

So nevermind the MT, I had Choffman cast this on the Peacekeeper, and then the Guardian on C. Hoff. Nothing would die forever.


Q though. Wounds get reduced to the number of wounds the model has remaining, right?

If C. Hoff took 6 wounds, but only had 1 left, all that would get passed on is the 1, right?

[Jonas Albrecht]

^ Derp, this is me.

[LoboStele]

So nevermind the MT, I had Choffman cast this on the Peacekeeper, and then the Guardian on C. Hoff. Nothing would die forever.


Q though. Wounds get reduced to the number of wounds the model has remaining, right?

If C. Hoff took 6 wounds, but only had 1 left, all that would get passed on is the 1, right?

Hmm...interesting....I see the logic there. I don't much like it though. I think it's still 6 Wds total, it's just that a unit can never be reduced below 0. My guess is that if you are using the Protect Spell, it would kick in as soon as the model would take Wds, which would be before the step where you check to see if enough Wds have been inflicted to kill the model.

[karn987]

Hmm...interesting....I see the logic there. I don't much like it though. I think it's still 6 Wds total, it's just that a unit can never be reduced below 0. My guess is that if you are using the Protect Spell, it would kick in as soon as the model would take Wds, which would be before the step where you check to see if enough Wds have been inflicted to kill the model.


Agreed. I don't believe it would get reduced for where this spell is concerned.

So if Hoffman got hit for 6 Wds and he had only 1 left, I believe protect would shift all 6 over to the Guardian.

[Jonas Albrecht]

Well that makes sense. However damage still gets converted to the amount of wounds available, right?

[LoboStele]

Well that makes sense. However damage still gets converted to the amount of wounds available, right?

Well, to be clear, Dg gets converted to Wds by things like Armor and such. I'd honestly be careful about using the word 'damage' to = 'Dg', as Wyrd's definition of 'after damaging defender' for triggers and such, obviously refers to the entire cycle of inflicting Dg and converting it to Wds.

So, seems like Wyrd uses the word 'damage' in the more all encompassing sense.

[Jonas Albrecht]

Yes, though I'm trying to clarify that if I have 1 wd left, and I take 10 damage, I'm going to suffer 1 wd under normal circumstances.

[LoboStele]

Yes, though I'm trying to clarify that if I have 1 wd left, and I take 10 damage, I'm going to suffer 1 wd under normal circumstances.

No, I believe you would take 10 Wds (unless you have armor or something else to reduce the Dg).

It's just that once you reach 0, the piece is considered to be dead, and then move past the 'taking Dg/Wds' stage and move onto the 'i'm dead' stage (which is where Slow To Die, etc. kicks in, and thus why a Healing Flip as a S2D action works).

[Jonas Albrecht]

In that case, I've been operating under a fundamental misunderstanding of how damage and wounds work.

[Hookers]

In that case, I've been operating under a fundamental misunderstanding of how damage and wounds work.

Wow me too.

I'm not entirely sure that is correct.

For instance, lets say you trigger Dumb Luck and red joker it for something like 20 damage on a model that has 6 wounds left. I thought you were limited to the amount the model had and would therefore take 3 wounds yourself, not 10. If that's not the case the incentive to use the trigger is probably cut in half. No fun. :ballchain

[lastakodo]

I'm pretty sure Lobostele is on the mark here.

As for dumb luck that would be spectacular enough to see that little gremlin light up that I'd do it anyway personally

[Jonas Albrecht]

I guess the line concerning this that has me confused is on Page 44, which states "a model can only suffer as many wounds as it has remaining", which has had me thinking that if I have two wounds left, the most I will suffer regardless of the damage amount it two, meaning that if I do a soulstone flip, only the black joker will fail to keep me alive.

[Ratty]

OK.. I'm going to answer some of these questions in a seperate thread as it has nothing to do with the original question.

[Jonas Albrecht]

OK.. I'm going to answer some of these questions in a seperate thread as it has nothing to do with the original question.

Excellent.

[Ratty]

OK thread now up. http://wyrd-games.net/forum/showthread.php?p=234878#post234878