Spirit movements

[CrouchingMoose]

I know first hand that spirits can move through impassable terrain ( really fun if your board has a bunch of empty buildings).

My question is can a spirit stop half way through or inside impassible terrain. The idea is I can put some buffing guy like grave spirit on a hanged and have the hanged stick halfway out of the terrain (building wall or the like) and leave the grave spirit inside the building but still in base contact.

Or could I hide a spirit inside one of rasputina's ice pillars to protect them?

[Buhallin]

Rules Manual, p10:


Spirits can move over and stop on impassable terrain.

The wording's a little odd, but I think yes, spirits can stop inside something.

[CrouchingMoose]

That's what I thought, but if so that can make Kirai's crew super defensive unless your opponent starts smashing terrain, which would be a big waste of actions. It also makes for good hit and run tactics for faster models such as attack and then retreat into the terrain for no los and full obstructing cover.

Another question pertains to moving vertically. If there is a bridge that is 4Ht could ikiryo move up onto the bridge as long as it was directly under it or so. Or are spirit subject to the same climbing rules as other models.

[K.blas]

That's what I thought, but if so that can make Kirai's crew super defensive unless your opponent starts smashing terrain, which would be a big waste of actions. It also makes for good hit and run tactics for faster models such as attack and then retreat into the terrain for no los and full obstructing cover.

Another question pertains to moving vertically. If there is a bridge that is 4Ht could ikiryo move up onto the bridge as long as it was directly under it or so. Or are spirit subject to the same climbing rules as other models.

I tried this during a game, and for that instance, we ruled on a no since Ramos's crew could have only "attacked" me with an Electrical Creation. Would like an official ruling to this though.

Oh and Ikiryo doesn't have float/fly so I would say no, she can't get to the bridge as there's no way for her to get up there.

[Buhallin]

Spirits have to climb like anyone else - it's what makes the Shikome's Flight/Spirit combo not redundant.

I can see some possible abuses with spirits hiding inside things, especially for positional strategies/schemes. I think using that as part of hit-and-run tactics is cool enough to work, and AP restrictions mean few models can truly protect themselves all the time. I'd be far more worried about "I need a model in your deployment zone, so I'll park inside this building and sit there where you can't touch me."

[karn987]

Umm... spirits can not stop in terrain, the wording doesn't support this at the very least. At the very most, it strikes me as a major abuse.

Rules Manual Page 10:
"Spirits can move over and stop on impassable terrain"

In order to stop inside of a piece of Impassible Terrain (like say a hill) it would need to say they can stop in impassible Terrain. The stop on part allows them to stop on say Deep Water or a pit.

You will need a Rules Marshal on this on as I doubt the intention is to let them hide in a Hill or in a wall but it seems to have no issue with them moving through them if it can in 1 action.

[Buhallin]

I thought about that, karn, but that reading would imply that spirits cannot move through walls either - they'd have to climb over them just like everyone else. It would limit the Spirit mobility to essentially just going over the deep water and pits you mention, and make it functionally almost the same as Float.

It's possible that's the intent, but it certainly seems to go against the standard way most people have been reading Spirit.

[Talishko]

I always thought it works like float with some extra goodies (no corpse counter, half damage, etc..)

The idea of using them as real 'ghosts' is nice but then they would also have to ignore every physical damage, etc. Could get too complicated.

[karn987]

I thought about that, karn, but that reading would imply that spirits cannot move through walls either - they'd have to climb over them just like everyone else. It would limit the Spirit mobility to essentially just going over the deep water and pits you mention, and make it functionally almost the same as Float.

It's possible that's the intent, but it certainly seems to go against the standard way most people have been reading Spirit.


The intention with Spirit to me at least seems to be they can move through and over Impassible terrain but may not stop in it. Stopping in it causes abuses (like people have stated here) but being able to move through it makes sense.

@Talishko: It is written very much like float to. The intention may not be that they can pass through walls since they took that ability away from a lot of models. RAW supports that heavily.

[KenS]

I seem to recall a ruling saying they could not stop inside terrain, but for the life of me I can't find it.

[Talishko]

also, i think models lose flight and float on indoor locations (not 100% sure but kind of remember reading it in the encounters section) whereas spirit would stay on. It makes sense to having to 'float' up the height of the hill though (as if climbing) as it is still distance.

[Genetic]

I always thought spirits moved threw terrain, but the new rules manual say they move over impassable terrain.. So my question is if they are indoors and cant actually go over a wall, how does that work.. or if you try to go into a building with a roof on it? Or have i messed some thing ?

[Ratty]

I believe it's meant to work more or less like before, but they wanted to avoid people abusing models stopping in impassible terrain. I don't think the wording works as intended.