Nicodem-Strategy and Tactics

[shekbo]

This thread was inspired by a similar helpful thread posted by... Um... The pink one. That was for Zoraida, and it was very interesting and informative. So I thought: why should the neverborn players get all the help? Us zombie guys need a leg up sometimes too!

So without any further ado,

Nicodem.

I chose Nicodem mostly because he's the master I play most often, and also because he's flexible and thus tricky to master.there are many different situations where Nicodem should act a certain way, and many others where a player needs to react quickly and definitively if they want to stay alive.

Basic tactics for Nicodem

*Nicodem is agruably the best summoning master in the game. The Reanimator spell is your greatest tool with Nicodem, and whenever you have nothing much going on, you should use it.
*
(Pro tip! Corpses not lying around? The reason Mortimer is a handy minion for Nicodem to have is the Exhume spell, which is a great way to get a corpse early game and summon it immediately. Remember that Mortimer can even companion Nicodem for a quick one activation summon!)*

Nicodem in combat

*As a whole, Nicodem is not a powerful combat master. His most useful combat ability is probably rigor Mortis, which you can use to freeze an opponents nasty minion or even their master. the decay spell in combat isn't overwhelmingly powerful, and should really be used to just finish off vulnerable enemy models, because it doesn't do tons of damage. If Nicodem is in melée, don't attack, instead focus on getting out or having a handy zombie kill the enemy model. Nicodem's low defense makes him a tasty target, so try to keep him out of direct combat.

What do I hire?

*The biggest question for a prospective Nicodem player is what to hire as a starting crew. The box set for Nicodem is actually a terrible crew for Nicodem, as the punks are primarily a summoned figure. One of the best figures for a starting crew is actually the canine remains, because for only two points, you get a figure that's only too happy to charge right into melée and provide you with a corpse, as well as maybe doing some damage along the way. Remember: with Nicodem, a figure dying is at most only a minor setback. Also, Mortimer is an excellent figure for a Nicodem player, because he's a good source of corpses when you're not sure if you'll be able to get them easily. He's a must if you may be facing a construct army or Lady Justice, the corpse denying arch-foe of any Nicodem player. You may also want to include a heavy figure that Nicodem can't summon, such as Killjoy, Betty or the Hanged. They make good heavy hitters and can hold down the fort while Nic reanimates some zombies. For a totem, the vulture seems like the obvious choice, but really i've found that depending on the point value, you may want to take the grave spirit. For 25 points or less, grave spirits your best bet. Above that up to 30 one vulture is good, past 30 two vultures are a must to ensure that Nic can take advantage of any corpse that drops.

Nicodem on Crows

*save all crow cards you get. Any high crows need to be used to Reanimate, and low ones are good for cheating the second flip on Mortimer's exhume. Don't throw them away on attacks.

So Many Options! What do I summon?

Nicodem has more summoning options than any master in the game. This can get a little overwhelming, as Nicodem can summon:
Canine Remains*
Crooked Men
Punk Zombies
Steampunk Abominations*
Necropunks
Flesh Constructs
Rotten Belles

you'll notice I've marked a few with asterisks. These are models I would never really see myself summoning in any situation. The others, however, are all excellent choices depending on what's going on at the moment.*

Crooked Men are the only unit Nico can summon who can deal damage at range. They're also really good against clumps of enemies. They're a good early game summon, or anytime you can't summon the model close to melée combat.

Punk Zombies are great melée bruisers. If you can summon a model. (remember you can place it anywhere within 6") into melée, or especially into a clump of enemies, make it a punk. Even with one action it'll deal good damage, and accurately too.*

Necropunks aren't necessarily that tough or powerful, but they've got one thing going for them. They can move faster than nearly all the reader figures, and that means they're great objective achievers. They can snag chests, rush into corners of the board to reconnoiter, or sprint into an opponent's control area to screw up their objective.*

Rotten Belles are not as heavy hitting as the punks, and not as quick as the Necropunks, but they're good support units for a crew of zombies. A single belle can play merry hell with enemy armies when supported by crooked men or punk zombies. The Lure spell is brutal when combined with the crooked man's Shafted, or the punk zombie's pure melée power. When they have no one to lure, their attack skills are passable enough, and the undress spell can be good for softening up a tough defender.

Flesh Constructs cost two corpses, rather than one, like everyone else. While it's true that this is the most expensive model Nic can summon, I've not had a huge amount of sucess with it. It tends to be a card drain to keep more than one on the field, and it's low defense makes it a target. Which is, in fact, precisely what it excels at doing. It is an excellent meat shield. It can take a large amount of punishment and the relentless advance ability makes your opponent think twice about letting it live to the closing phase. It does give a nasty amount of punishment in melée, and like the punk zombie, it really only works if you can summon it into melée range of an opponent's model.*

So that's a few ideas on the situations you would summon any of Nicodem's options. The other question you'll likely face when playing Nicodem is

Which (0) action do I use?

Nicodem has two powerful (0) actions. Both affect models in a wide swath of the board, and both can be exceedingly annoying to your opponent.

Bolster undead can make your army of shambling beauties into a bunch of powerhouses. If you want to use this, you want to make sure that Nicodem activates before the bulk of your horde, so that they can benefit from the combat buff. Also, you want to ensure that you can effect the most models possible: don't use the buff if you'll only get one zombie. Also keep in mind that due to embrace death, Nicodem benefits as well. This is good if he's coming under attack, because 4 defense is much better than 2.*

The other (0) action you could use is arise, perhaps the finest attrition tool in Malifaux. It causes every corpse to get up and annoy the heck out of your opponent, and the worst part of it is that any action taken to kill mindless zombies is an action totally wasted, because they can just get right back up! These little guys have numerous uses, the best being to tie up enemy ranged units, move into range of Nicodem's Reanimator spell or to stand near Nicodem to enable him to use the zombie fodder ability and avoid damage easily. If they manage to get an attack off at your opponent, good for them. It probably won't connect, but it might cause your opponent to waste a card cheating it off. Use this spell when your zombie ranks are getting a bit thin, and corpses are common. It can help buy you time and protect your valuble models, even if your zombies will be less effective this turn.*

If you can pull it off, these (0) actions are best used in conjunction. Summon a bunch of mindless one turn, and if there's still a bunch around next turn then a Bolster action will make them really irritating for your opponent to get rid of.

So I hope this helped a few people get a bit more accustomed to Nicodem and the adaptive strategy required to play him well. If anyone has any feedback on how this thread can be improved, or additional strategy tips, i'd be glad to add them in. Thanks, all!

************NEW SECTION!!!************************

Rising Powers: How does it affect Nicodem?

With the addition of Rising powers, many people will have looked at the new resser section and thought "Gosh, now I'll have tons of new non-unique undead for Nicodem to play with!"

Well, sorry.

Unfortunately for old Nicodem, the second book doesn't add any new models that should immediately enter the summoning repetoire of our good friend, and since most of the spirits are expensive, and none leave corpses, they aren't great for starting crews.

The one model that nearly, nearly works for Nicodem players is the guild autopsy. It's a cheap undead with a ranged attack and terrifying effects, and despite its fragility, it seems like a perfect support model for a Nicodem crew. Except for one hitch: It does not leave corpses due to an unlucky ability.

But, just as it seems that all might be lost, we have a single, gigantic, monstrous ray of hope. The Rogue Necromancy, the summonable heavy hitter Nicodem players have been dreaming of. He's big. He's bad. He has ranged attacks, terrifying effects, and you can summon him for four corpses. That is not to say, however, that you should try to save up to four corpses just to summon him. Four individually summoned belles/punks/crooked men will still outperform the Rogue Nec nearly every time, but the real advantage he has is that it just takes one spell to bring him out. Nicodem players, when you are pressed for time and have plenty of corpses, do not hesitate to throw him down. In fact, you should all probably proxy him right now because he is a great thing to have around if you wind up fighting another zombie master, hordes of gremlins, or another army that will leave you with a lot of corpses.

The resser henchman, molly, may be a good choice for Nicodem armies who like belles, though she's far from ideal. For one thing, she's expensive and only leaves one corpse if she does die, which she won't, but you'll be hard pressed to use her effectively to pay for the points. I would not recommend her for a nicodem crew.

Another model worthy of a further look for a Nicodem crew is the night terror. Though it is a spirit, and it doesn't leave a corpse, it is just the anti-ranged attack support Nicodem desperately needs. If you're fighting Perdita or another range-heavy crew and you want Nic to have time to build up some zombies, throw Mortimer in there with a few Night terrors. Mortimer can dig up corpses to make up for the ones lost on the night terrors, and the terrors can keep the ranged attackers of Nic while the summoning machine builds up.

[Ropetus]

Nice writeup. Allow me to make one correction:


Also keep in mind that due to embrace death, Nicodem benefits as well. This is good if he's coming under attack, because 4 defense is much better than 2.*
Nicodem is not affected since Auras never affect the model using it, unless the ability states so and this one doesn't.

-Ropetus

[Zambayoshi]

I've ordered the Nicodem box set, a vulture and a pack of mindless zombies.

How many mindless should I have ready to go for a 25-30ss scrap?

Thanks for the guide, it's great!

[jmp_mydog]

Depending on your opponent (models that leave corpse or not) you'll want to have at least 6.

[dahli.llama]

Nice write-up.

I just played my first game with Nico last night, and I definitely agree that he's tricky. I didn't realize that the flip from Mort's Exhume could be cheated, so that would have helped a bit, but otherwise the lack of ranged power to slow my opponent (Viktorias) hurt. I will have to look into getting some Crooked men into the crew ASAP.

[Hatchethead]

Depending on your opponent (models that leave corpse or not) you'll want to have at least 6.
Yeah, I need to find some good proxies (since I can't stand dupes). Had a game last night with the original three, ran out. My opponent was kind enough to allow me to use Punks as stand-ins, but that won't fly against most people.


... but otherwise the lack of ranged power to slow my opponent (Viktorias) hurt. I will have to look into getting some Crooked men into the crew ASAP.
Indeed. I went up against Ortegas with two Crookedies and they really helped. Cave In + Bolster + Cooked versus shooting, they're auto-includes against Perdita and fam. Three Canines and Bete also ensured I got in close, fast. Healing with Decay during melee really put my opponent in a bad spot. My Vulture trundled around and picked up the corpse counters (of which there were many).

[shekbo]

If you're looking for "ranged" support, here's what I always do.

Include a Hanged in your starting crew, along with the grave spirit. Link those two up. Bang, youve got an unkillable hanged. it has two EXTREMELY nasty ranged attacks, whisper from beyond which can just demolish high health figures, and hangman's knot which, while it doesn't do a lot of damage, can suck your opponents into your melee units really nicely. If you need more ranged damage, crooked men are ok, but that spell is hard to pull off. I'd recommend going about half melee, half belles and hanged, the latter can yank enemy units into the former, and the former can cut them up. Also, if you're looking for units that can get into close range quick, look no further than the bloodhound ability on the canines. All you need is one good cave in from a crooked man to deal one or two damage to a bunch of enemies, and all the dogs can charge in and attack them for only 1 action. combined with Nico's Bolster, they can be nasty little bruisers with 6 cb and 7 df.

@ropetus: Let me clarify your correction by saying I also forgot that Nic's defense is 3, not two. But I believe you're right anyway, and I apologize for that mistake. I've been playing that way since first getting him, but I guess I've been doing it wrong.

[Natty]

*save all crow cards you get. Any high crows need to be used to Reanimate, and low ones are good for cheating the second flip on Mortimer's exhume. Don't throw them away on attacks.


Mortimer's flip is not cheatable. There is nothing in the rulebook that allows you to cheat this flip. This is cleared up in the FAQ.



If you can pull it off, these (0) actions are best used in conjunction. Summon a bunch of mindless one turn, and if there's still a bunch around next turn then a Bolster action will make them really irritating for your opponent to get rid of.


If I remember correctly (I am at work and I don't have the book in front of me, someone wanna check for me?), the bolster spell only affects friendly models. Mindless zombies are not friendly models and are not hit by the spell. I am fairly certain that even when you activate them, mindless zombies are just controlled by you, they don't have any ability that says they count as friendly, much like an obeyed model is not friendly to you, it is just an independent entity with no army (again, no book, but that's what I remember reading, someone check my ramblings).

[LastDinosaur]

The extra errata changes Exhume to be cheatable.

Also.. Mindless Zombies are friendly while you control them, so they get bonus Cb, but not bonus Df (which is the important thing here).. This last bit is argueable, but this is my interpretation of it.

[Chucklemonkey]

A very interesting read as I see Nic as my next master.

I notice you mention taking Bete as your hard hitter, whilst I would never see her as a waste, as you can summon other undead for free is she worth spending the points on in a nic crew?

[Hatchethead]

The extra errata changes Exhume to be cheatable.
Yar, specifically WS's "living" errata (http://wyrd-games.net/forum/showthread.php?t=10309).


Mortimer
Exhume
Description should read as: "Flip a Fate Card from the top of your Fate Deck. If the card is a http://wyrd-games.net/forum/../images/smilies/Crows.gif, place 1 Corpse Counter within 6” of this model. The flip may be cheated. This spell may only be cast once per turn.Awesome change, a win for the Team Rez!


I notice you mention taking Bete as your hard hitter, whilst I would never see her as a waste, as you can summon other undead for free is she worth spending the points on in a nic crew?
I can't speak from a TON of experience, but I used her last night to great effect versus the Ortega family. There's often a ton of fodder on the field in a Nic game, lots of death for Bete to be drawn to. You can deploy quite a few cheapo models, knowing their eventual corpse counters will be resurrected as more powerful minions. I found her indispensable. She killed Papa Loco (the perfect candidate to drop the crazy bugger), took a chunk out of Perdita and tied up friggin' Nino until games end (he would've died next turn, had the game continued).

[Q'iq'el]

I notice you mention taking Bete as your hard hitter, whilst I would never see her as a waste, as you can summon other undead for free is she worth spending the points on in a nic crew?

I think she has the best synergy with Nik. Granted, she'll work good for anyone, but:

1. Nicodem can summon everything for free, so it's much easier for him to set aside spare points to take a very expensive model.

2. Nicodem can heal undead. While Bête has excellent defenses of her own, and can typically bury herself to heal and survive if killed, there are smart opponents with lucky hand that may spoil such plans. Being able to keep her topped is additional protection.

3. While Bête Noire is a scary fighter on her own, just like Punk Zombies, both of these become real monsters under influence of Bolster Undead. She can easily dispatch or at least completely disable a master with her paralyzing strikes, when her Cb reaches 9 with paired weapons and all she needs to paralyze is to hit the target.

4. It's best for her to arrive when opponent kills your own model (as she'll be able to activate directly after the attack and strike back). While all Resurrectionists can provide cheap sacrificial models to get her where they want her, Nobody can do it as easily as Nicodem.


To sum up, she's an expensive and relatively fragile model. Her defenses can be overloaded or bypassed. But she's both deadly and comes with great utility and all that gains greatly on reliability under Nikodem's command.

[Raintar]

His Bolster Undead is also insanely good. The heal is incredibly useful and also the paralyze and Raise Dead. I've seen him best used with Vulture dropping Beter Noir and Killjoy. But I saw a list based around Steampunk Abombinations keeping pace all together eventually leading up to a charge by 2 Bolstered Desolation Engines. Very nasty, and Nicodem can heal that thing as he does frequently, and best of all it blasts off them for damage.

[shekbo]

I love bete as a heavy hitter. I usually go with her or Killjoy or a hanged/grave spirit combo for my nasty figure.

She's excellent for assassinate especially against summoning masters. I'd always always take her for an assassinate strategy. She's also a big psychological fear for your opponent in a model that just won't die, and as was said before, Bolster just makes her a little bit ridiculous. She'll basically always be going after the master or an expensive model, and she's great for making your opponent bleed lots of soulstones or even lose their master.

[Xango]

very interesting, so for 30ss, what should i get???

[ProdigalPunk]

very interesting, so for 30ss, what should i get???

Start with lots of cheap models and then when they die summon better ones. Do that plus have maybe one utility model and one heavy and you should be set. Also I always include a vulture, but do not over extend it, I tend to leave it out to dry foolishly and watch it get wacked. If I am going with Kill Joy as my heavy then I go necropunks, as their slow to die comes in hand for that last second sac. If I am going Bete I tend to go with dogs (although I always try to throw in some dogs as I need those hard to reach corpse counters with Nico most of all)

[Q'iq'el]

very interesting, so for 30ss, what should i get???

For very start, Nicodem starting box is absolutely excellent. Punk Zombies are very good for any master, but even better with Nicodem's buffs. Mortimer makes the crew a bit faster (speed is the weak point) and can help get Zombies quicker too.

Vultures are nice to have (you can have 2, as they are "numerous"), but even more needed are Mindless Zombies. Nicodem absolutely needs them both for his own protection (his defense is low and he has to keep some zombies around to protect himself) and to bog down the opponent.

Personally I got 3 Mindless Zombies with Nico, but I feel 6 is more practical (I have all 3 up and lots of spare time to get more most of the time). If only there was another blister with different Mindless Zombies available - the ones available are quite individual in their looks and I don't want to duplicate them.

On the other hand Zombies are probably the easies models to proxy (so many out there), so you can go for some other models altogether and get 6~9 without shipping costs or need to duplicate. I just couldn't resist Wyrd's own set. :D

Nicodem can raise practically anything (except for Spirit models, so look out for those) and everything brings something to his crew. After you get the book and learn how to play his crew, you can easily expand it to get some more "specialized" undead to round up the crew.

[shekbo]

Actually, with the box set I don't use the punks to start. Punks are an excellent summon, and it's much better to start with a 2 point dog, have it charge in and get itself killed, then summon a 5 point punk who may already in melee combat.

for 30ss, you've got a choice between Bete and Killjoy. With 25 bete's a better choice, and at 35 I'd go killjoy, but at 30 it's just your preference for heavy hitter.

My normal 30ss usually looks like this.

Nicodem
1 grave spirit
1 Mortimer
1 hanged
1 Bete Noir
2 dogs

I love the grave spirit and hanged combo, it's just ludicrous how much punishment those two can take, and betty's always a nightmare. I don't like the vulture because I don't really have that many models. Generally speaking, my strategy is to hangman's knot a hapless living model within range of my dogs' "bloodhound" actions, and I activate them both with Mortimer as his zombie companion action. Mortimer's job is further ranged support and digging corpses whenever I have a low crow I can use to cheat the flip for it. Betty happens whenever I kill something, and I always keep a card in reserve to save her.

[NameBreaker]

Hello every one! Frist time post from a long time lurker, i'll be running my frist game this weekend. While i'm not going to be playing i'll be dealing with all the rules stuff. One player is playing Nic and while looking for combos/tricks i found the Canine Remains has the Graverobber Trait. Unless i missed an erretta somewhere along the way this means that a turn one summon can keep Nic supplied with Corpse Counters.

The real question is: If we're using the starter box for Nic how hard is it for him to get Corpse Counters rolling?

And my frist post is a fail since it seems Graverobbers cannot Search for Corpse Counters, only pick them up

[hippieshopper]

Hello every one! Frist time post from a long time lurker, i'll be running my frist game this weekend. While i'm not going to be playing i'll be dealing with all the rules stuff. One player is playing Nic and while looking for combos/tricks i found the Canine Remains has the Graverobber Trait. Unless i missed an erretta somewhere along the way this means that a turn one summon can keep Nic supplied with Corpse Counters.

The real question is: If we're using the starter box for Nic how hard is it for him to get Corpse Counters rolling?

And my frist post is a fail since it seems Graverobbers cannot Search for Corpse Counters, only pick them up

Actually it just depends on who you're playing.
If you're against Ramos, Raspy, or someone like that...the Dreamer is another I think. It will be a lot harder because you're relying on your units dying in order to get counters.

[Mach_5]

Anyone tried taking lots of dogs to start? I'm thinking for example Nico, Mortimer, Grave Spirit, and 10-11 dogs in 30ss (depending how many starting soulstones you want).

Seems like it could be really nasty;
- use mortimer to companion them all,
- cast fresh meat! once or twice to get in close and/or fling dirt to damage a few enemies,
- if no enemies are damaged, charge/attack something with a dog until you do damage, then all the rest can (1) charge for a gang beat-down

You really don`t need vultures with so many dogs around with (0) For You, Master. And if things go poorly for them... well, there`s plenty of corpse counters/mindless zombies around.

[hippieshopper]

Anyone tried taking lots of dogs to start? I'm thinking for example Nico, Mortimer, Grave Spirit, and 10-11 dogs in 30ss (depending how many starting soulstones you want).

Seems like it could be really nasty;
- use mortimer to companion them all,
- cast fresh meat! once or twice to get in close and/or fling dirt to damage a few enemies,
- if no enemies are damaged, charge/attack something with a dog until you do damage, then all the rest can (1) charge for a gang beat-down

You really don`t need vultures with so many dogs around with (0) For You, Master. And if things go poorly for them... well, there`s plenty of corpse counters/mindless zombies around.

You could use Sebs too, he can just companion one and all of them together.

I heard some people like to use the Hanged, use Hangman's Knot on something, pull it toward you then have your pack tear it to shreds.

[TimeLapse]

I dont know if anyone brought up this idea yet but i been thinking about trying it and was wondering what ppl thought of it,

Okay the list is basic
Nico + Grave Spirit + Mort + Sebastian + lots of dogs

So the idea is to kill some of your own dogs with sebastian right away to get alot of tokens. If you have alot of low crows in your hand then i would try for a peice for me, if you dont then just go for Bloody harvest and kill the lot of dogs and then arise them.

I think if you can get body parts and make more dogs, then kill them get more body parts and C. Tokens then you can have a corpse token factory with sebastian and Morty in as the machines and the K9 ren being processed.

I think that Sebastian is a fine addtion to this list and am wondering if my idea is worth it in the long run or is killing some of your own dogs right away going to slow me down too much since i most likely wont have much to move the first turn.

Also thinking that i may try getting a peice for me off on a necro puck thinking that there hard to kill may get me two parts before they die and a corpse.

Thanks for any advice,
Andrew

[shekbo]

It might work, the only concern is that dogs, for all their surprising nastiness, die really really fast. Blasts would beat that army quick. Though it would give lots of corpses for Nic to work with, I don't know how fast you'd be able to seize the advantage after the initial doggy die-out.

[TimeLapse]

It might work, the only concern is that dogs, for all their surprising nastiness, die really really fast. Blasts would beat that army quick. Though it would give lots of corpses for Nic to work with, I don't know how fast you'd be able to seize the advantage after the initial doggy die-out.


Yeah, I think it really depends on the hand, if i can't res two models with my starting hand i might onling kill 0ne or two dogs for some mindless zombies or just to carry till i can and send leave the other dogs around till needed.

Not sure how it will work eather but im hopping that i can find out how to use nico well.

[ddot]

The extra errata changes Exhume to be cheatable.

Also.. Mindless Zombies are friendly while you control them, so they get bonus Cb, but not bonus Df (which is the important thing here).. This last bit is argueable, but this is my interpretation of it.Actually, I believe your interpretation is spot on. Mindless Zombies are only controlled by Nic (and thus only Friendly to Nic) during the end of the Activation pahse (eg, after all other models have activated), so during the pre-MZ portion of the AP,hase, they do not benefit from Bolster Undead, but during the MZ portion of the APhase, they are.

[shekbo]

I wouldn't kill any of the dogs. Seems like wasted effort to me, when you can still fodder dogs if nico is hit, and they're going to die in droves anyway! If I start with a low crow I always go with Mortimer's exhume and cheat the flip for my first corpse. That leaves Nicodem in so much of a better position, and the dogs are better suited as suicide troops anyway.

[total.boredom]

Has anyone tried the Dead Rider with Nico?
I haven't tried it yet (actually... I haven't tried much... since I just got my first game in last week...)

But it seems like he could give some much needed mobility (plus, dragging people around sounds like fun!)

[Mach_5]

I've got a proxy I plan to use on occasion, but the steep ss cost means he's not an auto-include for me. Like you said, in some strategies that require a fast moving element to the crew he looks great. Would likely try to keep him in range of Nicodem's bolster, then strike out and drag opponents back for the punks to flurry on...

[Iamwyrd]

Has anyone tried the Dead Rider with Nico?
I haven't tried it yet (actually... I haven't tried much... since I just got my first game in last week...)

But it seems like he could give some much needed mobility (plus, dragging people around sounds like fun!)

I've tried him today. He seems decent with nicodem, the only problem is he is really fast so its hard to keep him close to nicodem for the bolster or the decay healing. But he still seemed pretty good. The 10ss cost is kinda high, but he is good. I may try to play more reserved next time with him just to see if he is a little better. Ill post it here when I try it.

[total.boredom]

I tried the dead rider out for myself last night as well, (second game, second tie!). Played against my friend's viktorias, and I was pretty impressed. He managed to drag back a convict gunslinger and someone else ( can't remember her name, but she had a glave and could get a 6" melée range) back to their messy deaths. He also dragged a ronin away from nicodem. Was also handy to bring the corpse counters back to nicodem. Most of all, it was fun dragging people around!

[quotemyname]

I'm not sure if this was covered in the tactica earlier or not:

Can Mortimer use his (All) Make My Own Friends spell to resurrect Nicodem due to Nic's ability to be considered undead, and lack of soul stone cost for being a master?

[Wodschow]

I'm not sure if this was covered in the tactica earlier or not:

Can Mortimer use his (All) Make My Own Friends spell to resurrect Nicodem due to Nic's ability to be considered undead, and lack of soul stone cost for being a master?

Eh.. All masters are unique so no.

Also I certainly don't think Nicodem can be considered Undead for purposes such as this when he's not actually on the field (very much like I'm certain that hiring him with Leveticus is a no-go).

[hippieshopper]

Yeah, he can't be summoned.

Someone asked a similar question at my LGS about turning Johan into the undeadliness and doing that. He did get a nice benefit from Bolster Undead though. (it was a 2v2 idea)

[Q'iq'el]

Was also handy to bring the corpse counters back to nicodem.

There are several wrongs with this.

1. To be able to pick up a corpse counter, you must be able to use it (Book1 p24). The Rider cannot use any counters.

In a classical Nicodem crew it makes only Nicodem and Mortimer capable of picking up Corpse Counters. Vultures work around the restriction - if you check the wording of their Bring back ability, you'll realize it is Nicodem who picks up a counter within 3" from the Vulture, not the Vulture itself.

2. You cannot drop a counter and a counter carried by another mini is impossible to use (Book 1 page 24). Even if the Rider could pick up counters, Nicodem couldn't use them. There are exceptions, but none of Nicodem spells falls into that category (if you want to compare with spells that can do it, check out Nephilims' Grow and Mature wordings).

[total.boredom]

Sorry, I was unclear with that,
He brought the corpse counters back before they were corpse counters. By dragging models back to be killed near nicodem, he helped control where they were placed.

I apologize for being unclear

[Brence]

I'd have to say altough I dont think many will agree I rather enjoy playing Killjoy in my Nicodem Crew at 35 points.
Nic's ability to summon Mindless Zombies with fair ease makes for a nice sacrificing unit to summon KJ to the table. Also they can act as a nice meat buffer when KJ thinks its better to charge your way then towards the enemy. In my last games where I used him he was quite impressive.

[Q'iq'el]

I'd have to say altough I dont think many will agree I rather enjoy playing Killjoy in my Nicodem Crew at 35 points.
Nic's ability to summon Mindless Zombies with fair ease makes for a nice sacrificing unit to summon KJ to the table. Also they can act as a nice meat buffer when KJ thinks its better to charge your way then towards the enemy. In my last games where I used him he was quite impressive.

The meat buffer thing is OK, but I don't think you can use Mindless Zombies to actually summon KJ.

Only crew members receive ability to summon KJ via Blood Sacrifice. Mindless Zombies are under Nicodem's Zombie Control if in range (and considered friendly in such case), but they do not become crew members due to their Neutral rule.

[Brence]

Hmmz didnt see that one, well throwing out a Punk Zombie just before death would also get KJ in the game.

[Borzag]

I think a dog would also work to summon Killjoy, yeah? It's something that I've been doing some research on, but haven't had a chance to test in practice. It's a (1) action to summon KJ, so having a dog Wk and then summon might do it... maybe.

[ispep]

While you can use a dog as a Killjoy delivery system, its not as good as a Necropunk using Slow to Die. The Necropunks are speedy, and will get more than 10 inches into your opponents face. Also, its better to bring Killjoy out during one of your opponents activations instead of your own. That lets Killjoy have some fun before your opponent gets to activate and wreck his day.

If you wanted to go with the dog, make sure your opponent has finished activating all of their models before you run the puppy up.

[hippieshopper]

While you can use a dog as a Killjoy delivery system, its not as good as a Necropunk using Slow to Die. The Necropunks are speedy, and will get more than 10 inches into your opponents face. Also, its better to bring Killjoy out during one of your opponents activations instead of your own. That lets Killjoy have some fun before your opponent gets to activate and wreck his day.

If you wanted to go with the dog, make sure your opponent has finished activating all of their models before you run the puppy up.

I gotta go with ispep's idea.

I prefer to use a slow to die action as well. Which makes Necropunks ideal.
Also if you get a Punk Zombie in the mix and he gets wiped out, you can try that too.

But just be warned...although I am sure you folks know this. As cool as KJ is, he's not invulnerable, so bringing in some backup is a great idea.

[Borzag]

Okay, finally got around to trying this on the weekend:

Rez v Rez (Nico vs McM), 20SS. He took a few Necropunks, the Chihuahua, a Flesh Construct (or was that summoned... can't remember) and Seb. I took KJ, Mortimer and a Burd.

Given the Strategies (his was Assasinate, mine was Recon) and Schemes (his Bodyguard vs my Land Grab) I'd planned to use KJ to eliminate McM, by delivering him via Gull and Punk Zombie (Mortimer digs up a corpse and Interacts with the Gull to hand it over, Gull flies over and creates a Punk via Reanimator, Punk does his thing). If all went well, create a couple of dogs to take quarters and whammo.

Worked out well, and agree that Summon KJ is the best way to use a Punk. If McM hadn't succesfully run away I'd have had him too...

Question based on a suggestion from the local Henchie: in larger games, would killing the Punk summon Bete AND summon KJ? I ask as Drawn to Death indicates that the model has to die (covered by losing the last wound) but Slow To Die means he acts before this, and therefore summoning KJ instead.

Just a thought...

[Sandwich]

Both Killjoy and Bete Noir are placed.
So yes, one Punk Zombie could be used to summon them both.

[Golden]

Please explain why, and "where" I can find the info to summon them both off the same punk. Your strategies sound solid Sandwich, but I seem to remember something about only one model being able to be summoned as a result of Drawn to Death. Think it was in the second book.

I had the same idea at one point, but remember finding a reason that it wouldn't work like that.

[Q'iq'el]

Please explain why, and "where" I can find the info to summon them both off the same punk. Your strategies sound solid Sandwich, but I seem to remember something about only one model being able to be summoned as a result of Drawn to Death. Think it was in the second book.

I had the same idea at one point, but remember finding a reason that it wouldn't work like that.

Drawn to Death is not a "summon". The model is placed. There's a difference - Placed models do not get Slow, for example, while the Summoned do.

Other than that you have to look into the threads discussing the rule of equivalency - it doesn't apply to everything.

[Golden]

Thank you, Qiqel. I didn't actually notice the difference in wording. Pointing it out should be enough to discourage any arguments from future opponents.

[MoosePandy212]

well i read this tactica but i am sad that it is so short and did not really help me :(. you say that rigor mortis is his most powerful combat spell but have you not looked at decay? nicadem is the master i want most right now and so i am reading these tacticas to learn more about the undead masters so that i will be better off when i finally buy my nicadem crew. thank you very much for writing this tactica

[quotemyname]

well i read this tactica but i am sad that it is so short and did not really help me :(. you say that rigor mortis is his most powerful combat spell but have you not looked at decay? nicadem is the master i want most right now and so i am reading these tacticas to learn more about the undead masters so that i will be better off when i finally buy my nicadem crew. thank you very much for writing this tactica

Nic was one of my first masters, and I play him frequently. I would have to agree that Rigor Mortis is the more powerful spell in combat. In Malifaux, activation control is KEY. Being able to create a hole in your opponents activations with Paralyze is amazing. As far as decay goes... It does damage, sure. But keep in mind that it heals undead units. Let me say that again. It heals undead units. I would submit that Decay is actually a support spell that doubles as a ranged attack from time to time. It is not to be used as his main source of offense. Nic should be healing his creations with that spell. If he really wants to hurt someone with Decay, he should STILL attack his own units, cheat down their resist, and have the spell blast onto adjacent enemy targets (or more of his zombies for healing)! The only time I really directly target an enemy unit with Decay is if I have a high Tomes in hand and foresee cheating it in for the discard trigger.

Rigor Mortis: Offensive
Decay: Mainly support; Some offense.

[shekbo]

I apologize about the short length, moosepandy, I think you'll find many cool tips and tricks in the replies to the thread, there is 5 pages of them.

A note about gravedigger: there was an early errata that made search not work with gravedigger. Dogs cannot search. Currently the only way to pull corpses out of nowhere is mortimer's exhume.

decay is a good spell, but for a master, it actually is one of the least powerful "main combat" spells. It's good for finishing things off, but rigoring your opponent's most powerful model for a turn, or two, or however long you want to keep it up... That's huge. Nicodem very much relies on a swarm of undead minions to do the real fighting for him. Rigoring a powerful enemy model than either subjecting it to a swarm of attacks or fighting something else while it's frozen is a great tactic. The other advantage of Nicodem himself having it is he can soulstone it to potentially freeze even masters. That is just huge, and can knock armies where the master is the lynchpin of the force haywire.

[Jonas Albrecht]

Love this Tactica, Shekbo, hoping you update it soon to reflect Rising Powers.

Also, what prevents Nicodem from summoning a Desolation Engine?

[Mach_5]

Per the errata, it has the rule Desolate: this model cannot be summoned.;)

[Jonas Albrecht]

Per the errata, it has the rule Desolate: this model cannot be summoned.;)

Ah, thanks!

[tadaka]

Per the errata, it has the rule Desolate: this model cannot be summoned.;)

Keep in mind he can hire them as well as the spa. He also can summon spa to make one.

[shademu]

I have a question earlier in the thread it was stated when you use decay on your own model you should cheat down there defense. I thought they could auto-fail but you had to still flip the cards. Please correct me if I'm wrong I'm quite new. I apologize if this is the wrong spot for this post.

[shekbo]

Hm... you're right, I should update this. Not a lot going on for ol Nic in book two except for the wonderful bag of fun that is the Rogue Necromancy. but a few more interesting options, to be sure.

I'm actually not sure about the auto-failing thing. I dont have a whole lot of experience with attacking my own models, and usually the ruling is just to do it as if you were doing a regular attack. I usually use my worst card in hand to cheat down the defender's flip, and hope for a moderate or severe damage, because those include blast effects that heal whole clumps of your own zombies.

[Alondir]

We have treated it as when you auto fail it becomes equal, so with things like obay thats not a problem but when you want blasts off of it you need to win by a margin so you can cheat. otherwise if you just want the heal as long as the spell is cast you can chose to auto fail cos its on your WP

[shekbo]

True. so the way it plays is

Cards are flipped. Player looks at cards. If, say, the zombie actually beat nicodem by a large margin, player can then choose to auto-fail, counting the result and damage flip as if it was equal?

[quotemyname]

Yes.

However, you should remember that your zombies will gain better benefit from you paralyzing nearby enemy models with Nic than they will from you simply popping a heal on them. After all, they can only heal 2wd per Decay. 9/10 times most models have a weak damage stat of 2. So you're really only protecting your minions from one attack. However, if you Paralyze an adjacent enemy model, you're really protecting them from two! At least! If not worse!

I'll say it as many times as necessary. When running Nic, if you want offense, use Rigor Mortis. If you want Defense/Support use Decay.

[Jonas Albrecht]

Hm... you're right, I should update this. Not a lot going on for ol Nic in book two except for the wonderful bag of fun that is the Rogue Necromancy. but a few more interesting options, to be sure.

I'm actually not sure about the auto-failing thing. I dont have a whole lot of experience with attacking my own models, and usually the ruling is just to do it as if you were doing a regular attack. I usually use my worst card in hand to cheat down the defender's flip, and hope for a moderate or severe damage, because those include blast effects that heal whole clumps of your own zombies.

I cannot wait to field the Rogue Necromancy with Nicodem. Not many zoms have a lot of tricks to them, and I'm eager to play one that does.

Shekbo, what's your opinion on Nicodem and Molly?

[Q'iq'el]

I'll say it as many times as necessary. When running Nic, if you want offense, use Rigor Mortis. If you want Defense/Support use Decay.

Heh, I'm the first to admit Rigor Mortis is Nicodem's most powerful spell, but that advice is just too categorical.

First and foremost, Rigor Mortis is expensive. You need a 10+ card to pull it out and you need to go higher than that to ensure it goes through (unless you are dealing with a very low WP oponnent, which is situational).
Secondly, soulstoning RM most of the time is a waste (it's one thing to use it to disengage out of melée with Lilith, it's another to merely Paralyze opponents minions) - this is a binary spell you get no added benefit from using a Soulstone, other than it getting through. If you cannot get it through with your Control Hand alone, consider boosting the Decay instead.

A soulstoned Decay on the other hand will get damage boost and may bring additional bonuses, other than the primary effect.

In other words, healing for 2 is worse than Paralyzed only on paper, because Decay can be an AoE spell affecting multiple models - both friendly and unfriendly at the same time. Yes, 2 wounds alone may only extend the life of your model for a turn, but the value of the spell changes when you heal 3 of your models and damage 2 opponents (one for 3, one for 5)? That's 6 wounds healed, and 8 caused in one cast... and a possibility for a free Mindless Zombie or maybe even a new Control Card. BTW this feature of Decay is the reason why Vultures are so good - the easier it is to pull the right angles when casting it, the more devastating the effect can be.


And I'm a big proponent of Paralyzing attacks. I think those are among the most powerful abilities in the game. It's just not back and white and RM itself is in the realm of the situational spells - very powerful, but limited to occasional use both by cost and the effect limited to single model only.

[Jonas Albrecht]

Boring question: Bete or KJ, which is better for Nicodem?

[Q'iq'el]

Boring question: Bete or KJ, which is better for Nicodem?

KJ has his fans and they'll stand by him no matter what, but I think Bête has more synergy with Nicodem. Her manner of entering play works better for his crew (outside normal entry methods, you can bring her from a Mindless Zombie sacrifice, when Nicodem gets attacked or even when you sacrifice a Mindless Zombie as a Corpse Counter, when summoning another model) and because she is a high-stat model, his buffs carry her even further. Besides, she's flexible and can bring killing power, Control Card drainage or Pralyzis to the table - all three abilities in high demand for Nico.

[Dark_Trainer]

I'm being told to avoid Crooked men, even though they work well with bells. Bells are more Seamus' thing.

I'm told Desperate mercenary and Guild Autopsy's which just came out are better to have. Especially at the start, more CHEAP models (and RANGED), when they die it's all good.

Also told some 4 corpse model which has 3 heads (which hasn't come out yet) is something I need to keep an eye out for? Any idea when it's released?

Also Vultures really haven't impressed me :( I might not be maximizing them...I'm honestly thinking about a grave spirit? 2 armor for nicodem seems awsome for 1pt?

I also bought 4 dogs, but haven't been thrilled with them. Was almost considering Necropunks since they can hold objectives, but I dunno...maybe having the dogs is nicer since they DIE and more counters kind of thing? I have Bette and not KJ so I don't need a KJ delivery system :P

[Q'iq'el]

I'm being told to avoid Crooked men, even though they work well with bells. Bells are more Seamus' thing.

That's clear misinformation. First of all, you want to have a Belle or two for Nicodem. He can summon them, he can use them. Nicodem is a slow model with a relatively slow crew. There are three things he can do to change it:

- Hire fast models (Dogs, Necropunks). Works great, but lacks synergy with Nicodem's buffing abilities, that require entire force to stay bunched up.

- Spam Mortimer's Fresh Meat. Specifically designed to work for the crew, great synergy. Nicodem can choose to benefit from it too.

- Hire or Reanimate a Belle and Lure opponents towards your fighters.


Clearly the last option works very well and Crooked Men enjoy just as much synergy with this as they would in a Seamus list.

However, the main reason you take Crooked Men in Nicodem's crew is their very solid ranged attack and quite good melee capabilities when bolstered. After they die in close combat, you reanimate Punk Zombies in their place and kill the opponent.


I'm told Desperate mercenary and Guild Autopsy's which just came out are better to have. Especially at the start, more CHEAP models (and RANGED), when they die it's all good.

The Dogs are somewhat better for that (dying). Desperate mercenaries are limited to 2, so there's not much you can gain with them.

I looked at Guild Autopsies long and hard and I fail to see how they are any good for Nicodem.

- Unlike Crooked Men, they remain bad in combat even after you Bolster them.
- You can only Bolster their melee Cb. Ranged weapon's Cb is locked in the low 4 by the Guard Pistol rule.
- Unlike Dogs, they are very slow.
- Because they are Too far gone they don't generage Body Counters when they die. That is what makes them more than useless for Nicodem.

Arguably Guild Autopsies can help against low Wp crews, but low Wp crews are the crews Nicodem is already strong against.
The only Synergy they do have, is with McMourning, who can summon them for the cheap. For Nicodem to Reanimate one would be a pure waste of a powerful and expensive spell. Even for Mortimer it makes more sense to bring a Crooked Man or Belle, if you want to sacrifice entire turn for that.


Also told some 4 corpse model which has 3 heads (which hasn't come out yet) is something I need to keep an eye out for? Any idea when it's released?

Rogue Necromancy. Yes, this is the biggest and baddest model Nico can Reanimate and as such, it is a must-have once it's out. Unfortunately, it hasn't been announced yet, so it makes it September at the earliest.

Dead Rider is a solid option if you want a big hitter for the games right now. It will be out soon and it is a real beast. The only drawback is, you cannot Reanimate it (Unique).


Also Vultures really haven't impressed me :( I might not be maximizing them...I'm honestly thinking about a grave spirit? 2 armor for nicodem seems awsome for 1pt?

If you want flexibility, you'll get 2 Vultures and Grave Spirit and swap them depending on the Encounter.

The terrain is the major factor here - Vultures are life savers and benefit Nicodem greatly whenever terrain makes his crew even slower than usual (Bog for example), when there are many LoS blocking features (a village, rocky outcrops everywhere, lots of forests and trees) or when the opponent brings a horde of models.

Vultures are also one of the best tools to protect Body Counters from masters which can destroy them. You just have to play them smart not to loose them fast - don't be too greedy.

The way I play Vultures, when I play Nicodem, is to keep one behind enemy lines and the other on hand to dash out to grab Body counters for Nico. If Vultures do nothing at first, opponent typically keeps on ignoring them. Then after you join the combat, when most of your models are in place, you can Perch the Vulture behind the lines in a good place and use him to cast Decay at the models engaged with your frontline. As long as they blast, they will damage his models and heal yours at the same time, while Nicodem can safely stay out of LoS and focus on keeping his aura up and bringing back fresh undead.

The trick is to use one Vulture before you activate Nicodem, to get Eyes and Ears going, and the second closer to the end of the turn, to grab the Corpse Counters out of Nicodem's range.


I also bought 4 dogs, but haven't been thrilled with them. Was almost considering Necropunks since they can hold objectives, but I dunno...maybe having the dogs is nicer since they DIE and more counters kind of thing? I have Bette and not KJ so I don't need a KJ delivery system :P

I don't like Dogs myself. Easy to get counters are the chief reason to bring some I think, though they can run and grab counters for you in a Treasure Hunt etc. (IIRC a pair of dogs can become significant temporarily). Necropunks work better, but even then you'll need them only situationally (certain encounters only).

Most of the time if you start with a fighty Nicodem crew, you don't need all that many counters at the beginning. Mortimer's ability to create counters is very good now, with 1 counter per turn being quite achievable in most games, so by the time you engage, you can bring up an extra minion or two.

[Fetid Strumpet]

I have to say that it is entirely possible that the Rogue Necromancy would be out in August. I've been informed that last year's Gen Con Releases were not listed as part of the offical August release. So if there was a special edition sculpt of the Rogue Necromancy released, or if it was part of a boxed set that had its release at Gen Con, say Molly's, it is possible it would be out at that time.

[Ratty]

Belle are good in every Ressurectionist crew other than Kirai (I would even argue that you could sneak one in with her and it would work out OK). Even if you don't start with them and summon them later with Nicodem. I've seen them used great with Nicodem walking forward and then dumping them on an elevated position with good view of the battlefield.

[Dark_Trainer]

Thanks for all the awsome replies! So it sounds like I DO need the crooked men, belles, Grave spirit, and the rogue necromancy to have better options for what I can field.

I didn't realize the autopsies didn't drop counters!? I was thinking initially a large 'cheap' models other than Bette, Mortimer, and convict gunslinger that I PAY for around a 35pt battle. Rest would have been filled with dogs and whatever...i like the idea the belles make nico faster...that's big.

[Ratty]

Thanks for all the awsome replies! So it sounds like I DO need the crooked men, belles, Grave spirit, and the rogue necromancy to have better options for what I can field.

I didn't realize the autopsies didn't drop counters!? I was thinking initially a large 'cheap' models other than Bette, Mortimer, and convict gunslinger that I PAY for around a 35pt battle. Rest would have been filled with dogs and whatever...i like the idea the belles make nico faster...that's big.

Have a look at Desperate Mercenaries, I'm thinking of using 2 instead of dogs with my McMourning.

[poulpox]

you can Perch the Vulture behind the lines in a good place and use him to cast Decay[B] at the models engaged with your frontline. As long as they blast, they will damage his models and heal yours at the same time, while Nicodem can safely stay out of LoS and focus on keeping his aura up and bringing back fresh undead.


Is this allowed? Vulture's Ears and Eyes (or whatever it's called :) ) doesn't allow gun icon spells to be cast through the vulture I think.

[pixelgeek]

Is this allowed? Vulture's Ears and Eyes (or whatever it's called :) ) doesn't allow gun icon spells to be cast through the vulture I think.

Just checked and you are correct no spells with gun icon ranges

[Zee]

...IF it is in melee. Read the whole sentence :D

[pixelgeek]

...IF it is in melee. Read the whole sentence :D

Hence perching it. :-)

[Dark_Trainer]

So other than lacking corpse counters, how effective do you think this would be.

Nicodem
Vulture
Mortimer
Bette
Killjoy

Equals 30 SS, so in 30 SS game he has a cache of 3, or in a 35 SS game I could bring a canine (maybe necropunk), or another vulture. Basically first vulture is to deliver Killjoy and Bette in one fell, attack...Mortimer is to assist with bringing corpse counters up over time, and vulture can companion nicodem to bring him forward and BOLSTER both killjoy AND bette after sacrificing the vulture. The idea to drop the Ressurectionist NUKE. :)

[Mazin1]

Necro thread, RISE!!

Is Molly worth bringing with Neco? I'm thinking of getting her box,
I even threw a list with her.

Nico(vulture) 6 ss
Molly(necro machine)
Mort
4 doggies
2 desprate mercs

[Q'iq'el]

Molly is definitely worth bringing with Nico, but that is especially so that you don't have to bring Doggies and Desperate Mercs, which only steal you precious AP when you have to move.

1st turn - Molly copies Exhume from Mort, Necrotic Machine casts it (as well as Mort) - you have 2 CC and still get to move with most of your crew (and can even boost Nico's movement).
2nd turn - cast Exhume with Mort, Necrotic Machine and Molly in the end - you have 5 Corpse Counters without slowing down. After that Molly can copy Rigor Mortis or Decay, if I'm not mistaken, or cast her own spells.


Fill up the crew with Punk Zombies and Crooked Men, and perhaps Bête Noire for good measure, and you have a classic Nicodem block with more hitting power and lots of Corpse Counter.

If you can fit Rafkin in, you'll be getting even more Corpse Counters out of it.

[Mazin1]

Ok. I thought it was bad to bring punk zombies, or at least better to summon them. What would be a good list featuring Molly?

[Q'iq'el]

Ok. I thought it was bad to bring punk zombies, or at least better to summon them. What would be a good list featuring Molly?

All of them, sure, but one, why not?

The Punk Zombies are slow. That is a problem when you bring them with McMourning or Seamus, but Nicodem is slower still - for him starting with at least one Punk Zombie isn't bad idea at all - anyone who charges Nicodem will have to take a counter-charge (or straight out Flurry) into consideration.

You can save 2SS by summoning it, but you spend 1 AP, 1 Corpse Counter and a high :crows card for that - it may simply not happen in time. With masters who can target you in turn 1, starting with a fighty crew makes more sense.

I personally want to try this, as soon as I get Molly box (preordered already):


Ressurectionists Crew - 35 - Scrap

Nicodem, The Undertaker -- 8 Pool
2 Vultures [4ss]

Molly Squidpiddge [9ss]
Necrotic Machine [2ss]


Mortimer, The Gravedigger [7ss]
Crooked Man [4ss]
Crooked Man [4ss]



and



Ressurectionists Crew - 40 - Scrap

Nicodem, The Undertaker -- 5 Pool
1 Vulture [2ss]

Molly Squidpiddge [9ss]
Necrotic Machine [2ss]


Mortimer, The Gravedigger [7ss]
Crooked Man [4ss]
Bête Noire [9ss]
Punk Zombie [5ss]





Because there's a decent chance for 5 Corpse Counters (reliably 2~3 but that's still enough) in the first 2 turns, I can summon Crooligans, Necropunks, Corpse Construct or Rogue Necromancy depending on my needs... and Punk Zombies out of Crooked Men, once they die (they are solid blockers, but they don't survive too long in melee). And I'll have Mindless Zombies up from turn 1 too, which is quite important these days.

I guess I could work in Night Terrors in the list as well, should the Strategy require really fast objective grabbers, but I'd rather bring models which drop Corpse Counters in most situations.

[Mazin1]

Ya, I've always like crooked men. Running a belle with them is pretty humorous. Watch out for that mine shaft.

Ill be ordering my Molly box tomorrow.

[demkoenig]

Yeah, I mean, I've played a bunch with Nicodem recently and learned that his strong suit really isn't summoning. I mean, here is how I would use Nico's summoning, in a pinch, without Molly.

Mortimer walks up 4" and then throw a corpse counter 6" in front of Nico.

Nico walks up 6" then uses Casting Expert to Reanimate a Belle 6" in front of him.

Belle Lures Nico his walk towards her.

Nico just moved 9" that turn. Now he's that much closer and can hopefully throw out at least one Rigor Mortis, if not two, or even better, three.

Now next turn, hopefully you have an enemy within 15" and a mask so Mortimer can Fresh Meat! Nico once or twice and Nico is even closer!

Oh, and Killjoy is amazing with Nico.

[Mazin1]

Molly is expensive but with the ability to copy any models spells, she becomes a swiss army knife. I'm really looking forward to using her.

[tat2dbowler]

Might have been addressed and I just missed it, but according to the wording as I read it zombie fodder is mandatory. Every other master with a similar ability has the word 'may' while his doesnt. Am I reading this right?

[Q'iq'el]

Might have been addressed and I just missed it, but according to the wording as I read it zombie fodder is mandatory. Every other master with a similar ability has the word 'may' while his doesnt. Am I reading this right?

I've always thought "sacrifice to cancel" implies the choice (in order to cancel you have to sacrifice). Not sure about RAI here.

[tat2dbowler]

Our groups always played it as optional, but im not so sure after seeing kirai's similar ability with the seishin. The big difference I see is the word 'may'